Is it contagious?


I’ve wrote about it quite a few times, and now I’m reading about it from others in the forum and in blogs – apathy towards poker, and just plain pissed off with poker!

It’s all taking the same forms. Either people are playing and getting dismal cards or on the end of constant horendous bad beats, or are just ‘pokered-out’! For me personally, I’ve rediscovered a few things that I used to enjoy, and these things have taken a huge chunk from my poker playing. Yes, I have better things to do than  play poker constantly!

angrypokerI can sympethise with those who feel the need to take a break, whether it’s because of a loss of form or on a big bad luck streak. If you remember, I wrote a piece on it a few months ago when I was going through the most difficult few months of my poker playing career. No matter what I did I lost. I knew I was playing good poker – going in with the best hands – only to see them gazzumped by idiot calls with idiot cards. There’s nothing you can do about it, but it’s so demoralising. And it makes you want to rip someones head off!!

One of the forum guys, and regular blog commentor, Lippy, is one of those going through a bad spell. He is blaming the site he has been playing at – something I have done too. It’s very easy to blame the site you play at as ‘favouring’ some players over others. Normally I am the first to poo-poo this suggestion, but considering most of my bad beats/suckouts/general shit luck was at the very same site, and also a few others have aslo commented that this is happening to them on this site, it is really starting to make me wonder.

Now I’m not for one second going to go all guns blazing and say the site is cheating certain players intentionally, but there is a pattern forming that has and is been noticed. Everyone who has complained about a bad spell has said the exact same things regarding this site.

Lippy for one generally cashes in at least a third of sit and go games he enters. Recently, he has reported that out of at least the last 20 games he has played he has got nowhere near the payouts. I know this is unusual for Lippy. I also know that what he is going through mirrors what happened to me a few months back.

Netsson, our little Sweedish angel, is going through the exact same thing. Gotmewrong has went through it recently too (although she did eventually pick up a nice $300+ prize a couple of weeks ago.)

We have all suffered the problem with going in with the best hand only to see someone calling with a hand so crap that they need both the turn and river cards to help them. Basically, a once in a bluemoon catch! The problem lies in that it’s not once in a bluemoon….. its every single game you play, and can be seen happen at least twice in each game!

The site seems to reward the idiots who call all-ins with 7 4 off up against your pocket aces. Normally, the flop is hugely in your favour with say a 8 A J showing. Then it hits you….. a 5 on the turn and you just know that the river will be a 6. You actually predict it! And there it drops….. that 6. They hit the ONLY two cards needed to beat you. The odds of it happening are huge. For it to happen to you in 10 games in a row (as happened to me…. and I’m being conservative!) the odds are of biblical proportions. The likelihood of seeing that happen in live games is virtually nil.

So why does it happen? Online sites use Random Number Generators (RNG’s) which supposedly give a completely random deal of cards. So why does the overwhelming favourite go down to so many unlikely beats? To me these sites need people spending money for them to make any profit – that’s obvious. To make more money the sites need more games starting. I think that the software deliberately hands out these beats to quicken the game, in the hope that when someone is knocked out of one game they will go into another. They want a constant turnover of games. How it chooses who is on the recieving end of these beats God only knows. But when you are that person it certainly is not fun.

How did I get through it? Well, I basically stopped playing at the site for around a week. Then I went back and played a few sit and go’s to see if anything changed. When nothing had changed I left it another week before playing again. Eventually it did turn around and I started winning again. The monkey had been passed onto someone elses back!

You will notice that I have not named the poker site that all this seems to happen at. I don’t think I need to…. just wait for the comments and I’m sure someone else will! I have more or less moved away from the site and only play the odd forum game and the odd game with the skype crew. Mainly because I’ve found a little nest-egg of a site that I really enjoy, and therefore tend to spend my time there.

So tell me…. is there a problem with online sites? Do you think they favour some players over others, or is it just the software deciding its your turn for an extreme run of cold cards? Conspiracy or are those who have suffered these events just a bit paranoid?


13 Responses to Is it contagious?

  1. Gotmewrong says:

    Well actually, the site you are refering to have always been good to me…. Well of course not always – I’ve had my share of bad beats in there, but generally I’ve been doing really well in there – especially in their 2$ Omaha hi/lo SnGs, placing in the money about 8 out of 10 times in those…
    Now PKR is another matter all together !! I’ve lately been doing what you suggested, giving PKR a break and only playing the odd forum game in there. I started out by staying away from there for about a week after suffering some REALLY bad beats and suckouts by some serious monkeys !! I used to place in the money in their 3 and 5$ SnGs at least every third or every other game…. After my week long break from PKR, I recently went back and dedicated a few hours to play the SnGs….. Think I played about 7 or 8 (which would usually have meant at least 2 wins and 2 seconds)…. I played exactly the same way I always play them (choosing my hands with care, being patient) and got more or less the same hands (read: mostly crap) as usual, and yet I didn’t make the money once !!!! I quickly spotted the monkeys in each game and made sure I went in with the best hand every time and still the monkeys managed to suck me out by hitting the turn AND river….
    Now I haven’t been back in PKR for about 2 weeks and don’t know when (or even if) I will….
    Forgot to mention that this all started happening right after I withdrew a lot of money from the site…. That sort of makes me wonder – especially since I’ve heard from others that the same thing happened to them after they withdrew… I don’t wanna start seeing conspiracies every where, but still….

  2. dagopher says:

    Now that you mention it AM, my bad streak started after I withdrew a large sum of money from the un-named site. We have to wait and see if anyone else comments similar….

  3. magpot says:

    i have never had much good luck but i beleive i played well there but dont play anymore unless it is a league game and then i am choosey of course the site im talking about is absolute and vegas there is the most impossible odds no matter what you play and i dont seem to that at others sites as frequently if your a river chaser play absolute and vegas

  4. saturn6022 says:

    I know exactly which site and sister site you are talking about Gofer. I only play league game at either site. I have had so many bad beats there it is unreal. Last night I again missed the money with a huge bad beat that I couldn’t even believe the idiot called me. I had the 2 top pairs on 4th street and put the other moron all in to the tune of 3000 chips. I had put in a preflop raise with my K Q suited, but in a huge raise when my q hit on the river and then put the moron all in on 4th street when my K hit. The moron called me with a J 7 off. There was only 1 card that could make this moron a winner and that was a 9 for a straight. You guessed it, the river was a 9. I was not out because at the time I was in 2nd place. But it seriously hurt the chip stack. 3 hands later on the final table I went all in with pocket kings. I was called with Q 10. You guessed it I was out in 9th. They got a Q 10 on the flop.

    This seems to me to happen at these 2 sites more than others. I don’t know why as I did not withdraw any funds from the site. I refuse to play any tournaments or tables there and I won’t rebuy at a rebuy tourny at these sites either. Because I know the type of hands that I will get if I do. I think that on rebuys they make the bad beats happen so you will be pissed of enough to think if you rebuy you can do better and get the guy back who beat you. No, that does not happen, and you end up throwing good money after bad.

    Oh well, thats online poker. I don’t know what the solution is.

  5. dagopher says:

    I knew there would be a few replies to this. I just hope someone from the sites reads the post and the comments. Too many are seeing the exact same things happening to them. It doesn’t happen on any other site that I play.
    However, it just so happens that I seem to be doing quite well in sit and go tournies at these sites (Abs and Vegas). I’ve cashed in virtually all of the last 10 I’ve played. I’ve only played one MTT of late and it was the usual suckout after suckout scenario.
    The only reason for playing there is that I still have some cash in both accounts and I was intending to play until they were depleted. But with the way things are going I’ll just try and get my bankroll at each site up to an amount I can withdraw and take the cash and run. I will keep a few $$ in each of them though… just to try and build up the money again.
    Maybe that’s the answer….. let your funds drop to a low amount and they let you start winning to keep you as a customer! I very much doubt it, of course!

  6. zitlips says:

    So there you have it. Major concerns about several theories leading to suspect behavior by said site. This has been going on too long. The randomness is no longer anything more than a fallacie, a lie, and an obvious cheat. Where is the control over this. Is it any wonder that the US is banning online gambling.?

    My money is locked up. Meaning that other than what I have left in this or any other site is all I have to work with. Never again will I “add” good fresh money anywhere. Actually I never was all won in freerolls.
    By the way..since my post in the league about Abs and vegas…my cards have gotten even worse….hmmmm

  7. Blagger says:

    Sorry guys I just cannot believe that a company that makes as much money as Abs or Vegas is gonna “cheat” you if you withdraw a measly couple hundred bucks.

    I know a couple of hundred bucks is lot to you and me but to these guys? They are making that much every few seconds at the very least.

    There is no way they would jeapordise their cash cow just to somehow cheat you out of a few bucks? Someone explain the logic to me on this one lol.. They would also be risking serious jail time.

    I know where yah’ll coming from been there myself and will be again no doubt, but… it is just human nature to blame or look for a conspiracy or cheat when things don’t go to plan or ‘when the trend gets bucked’.

    We all remember our bad beats but we quickly forget the umpteen times the odds pay us off as they should, when in a hand.

    Bad runs of luck happen, as do runs of good luck, wait till the end of the year and then look back and if you played the correct pot odds with the correct hands then you’ll be a winner over the 12 months. You can’t cherry pick a short term period and hold it up as evidence of anything except a ‘run of bad luck’.

    What was it Dog told me about Kid Poker (Daniel Negreanu) he went a whole year without hitting any money. This was the year after that famous year when he won the title Kid Poker. It’s swings and roundabouts folks but keep playing ‘correct poker’ and you’ll win more than you lose.

  8. zitlips says:

    Well gee. Thanks for clearing that up.
    I will now assume that there is no such thing as a polotician who is corruptable.
    Or an official who can “look the other way”.
    Or a professional athlete who doesn’t have a huge gambling debt and throws the game.
    Or and especially, a judge who can’t be paid to soften if not completely throw out penalties of illegal acts from “big money”

  9. Blagger says:

    Lippy come on.. lol Yah really think they are monitoring your posts on forums?

    The whole premise that they run a tweaked RNG makes no logical sense?

  10. zitlips says:

    LOL…naw…they wouldnt waste time on a cheap ass like me, but no one can convince me that probabilities of RNG tweaking cant exist. Codes exist in any software written. These codes are necessary for the software writers to modify them if there is a problem with the program, or if one developes. The temptation to profit from this possibility is tentamount to Catholic priests in a parish full of young men.

  11. Mumbolungo says:

    Interesting theories guys and gals! I have noticed the bad beats usually happen at cetain times of the day and can possibly be attributed to the increasing popularity of online poker. New people sign up for a site after watching Negranu et all and think they can win by playing any 2 cards. Then there are the drunks playing when its late evening in their country who again play any 2 cards believing (like you do when drunk) that you will hit your gutshot on the river! With so many countries playing in different time scales there will always be drunks playing from somewhere. Remember hearing a few years ago how the UK poker pros were getting up at 4am to play drunk Americans.
    But it could be our fault.For example I put in a big raise thinking there is no way they can call or generally trying some sort of move which against new or drunk players just goes right over their heads. Then there are some wierd poker theory books out there that suggests making huge raises in the position no matter who your playing against or what their card are.
    I have noticed in sit n go’s that if I recognise most of the players sitting at the table that generally the game will be decent and I’ll finish in the money but at a table full of unknowns the game is usually crazy with these horendous bad beats. Then of course there is all this poker tracker type software getting used on some sites it lets the other players see the cards you mucked on the previous hand- surely unfair.
    Who knows the answers? I’m having a break from poker just now. When I come back I’m going to start a diary like a professional gambler does. I’m interested where i’m winning and losing- for example what sites do I win more, at what stakes, with how many players, and at what time of day, with what blind levels?
    I find it hard to believe that a regulated site could be cheating but then again I’ve not heard of one being found out – surely only a matter of time!

  12. PinkDog says:

    Great blog G-Man and the comments are just as I would have thought but I got to side the Blags and Mumbo, well, except for Mumbo’s last 6 words.

    Bout all I can say about all this is to watch the players and not the site. Players are the only ones cheating and Monkey Players will be found at all levels of buyins.

    Dave’s blog could be a comment here so if ya have not read it, now would be a good time.

    Watch yourself Lippy because “They” are watching you.


  13. Mumbolungo says:

    Was talking about some of the smaller sites that have popped up with bases in weird countries. I’m sure that most sites are totally above board especially the UK sites owned by bookies etc.
    Think you have to find a site you trust, a game u like at the right level and watch what time u play. Then u have to be in the right frame of mind, with no family committments….
    Hold on its almost impossible! maybe I should just go back to freerolls and treat poker as a social pastime – maybe no bad thing.

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